Long delay for handgun purchase

Harvester · 03-30-2011, 07:49 PM

I recently saved up for a new hand gun and when the dealer called OSP for the background check they told them that it would be at the latest 30 days before they get a response. I filled the 4473 out right with my SS#. I have never had any record including traffic tickets. I have had state and Federal checks for my work. This my first Non-Face to Face firearms purchase and I am legal permanent resident of the US since I was a baby. So its been 2 weeks and still no reply. Has anyone encountered this situation? I am patiently waiting, but I hear that if it takes so long most of the time they don't respond at all? I have sent in an application for a UPIN#, but that takes months and I think it doesn't change anything because in Oregon the state does the checks. I am worried that they will make an erroneous denial or delay longer or not even respond. The dealer told me that they do not release a firearm with out a proceed(which is legal in Oregon) from the OSP. It is such a disappointment! I pay my taxes, I obey the laws, I am signed up for the draft, and I work in heath care with the public which has strict background checks and laws. Any insight, advice, experience with this would be much appreciated.

Nutty4Guns · 03-30-2011, 08:08 PM

Something with your name and or Identification might be very similar with someone else. I have never heard of this happening, so I am just guessing. I have done numerous purchases with many different dealers and have always been approved instantly over the phone. Best of luck to you. I hope it all works out.

Little Bear · 03-30-2011, 11:20 PM

Just keep checking back! And if that doesn't pan out, you could always try a different store. Some shop owners get wierded out for the strangest reason then blame it on OSP.

KrautBurner · 03-31-2011, 02:37 PM

I've purchased in Oregon (when I was a resident)
no wait.

but I was also Military and figure'd I was on file anyways.

if you really wanna know what they are looking at,
you can get a copy of your criminal record: FBI — Criminal Background Check

TheRedSkull · 04-02-2011, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harvester

I recently saved up for a new hand gun and when the dealer called OSP for the background check they told them that it would be at the latest 30 days before they get a response. I filled the 4473 out right with my SS#. I have never had any record including traffic tickets. I have had state and Federal checks for my work. This my first Non-Face to Face firearms purchase and I am legal permanent resident of the US since I was a baby. So its been 2 weeks and still no reply. Has anyone encountered this situation? I am patiently waiting, but I hear that if it takes so long most of the time they don't respond at all? I have sent in an application for a UPIN#, but that takes months and I think it doesn't change anything because in Oregon the state does the checks. I am worried that they will make an erroneous denial or delay longer or not even respond. The dealer told me that they do not release a firearm with out a proceed(which is legal in Oregon) from the OSP. It is such a disappointment! I pay my taxes, I obey the laws, I am signed up for the draft, and I work in heath care with the public which has strict background checks and laws. Any insight, advice, experience with this would be much appreciated.

i had this happen to me when i got my lower in, i had to wait 30days, i read on another site that its in part due to the fact oregon adds an extra step in background check (calling the OSP who will call the FBI, rather than just call the FBI). i also read about OSP denying the check and just delaying another 30days. but i may be misunderstanding something here, i waited my 30 days and i got my lower, it didnt make me feel very good when it happened though.

i feel your pain.

does any other state do this? i mean adding additional steps of red tape to make it harder for one to enjoy their rights?

Dragon Rider · 04-02-2011, 06:14 PM

got a rifle and pistol within last 30 days, each was approved over the phone and took less than 5 min to complete.

TheRedSkull · 04-02-2011, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragon Rider

got a rifle and pistol within last 30 days, each was approved over the phone and took less than 5 min to complete.

yes thats how it normally goes, but for some of us it seems we hit snags thanks to reasons outside our control.

PFWoods · 05-24-2011, 07:55 PM

I am now at 60 days for the purchase. The item was purchased online and now sits in a local pawn shop since April 2011. There simply MUST be a better way for Oregon to conduct their business. There si no reason whatsoever for this kind of delay.

TheRedSkull · 05-24-2011, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFWoods

I am now at 60 days for the purchase. The item was purchased online and now sits in a local pawn shop since April 2011. There simply MUST be a better way for Oregon to conduct their business. There si no reason whatsoever for this kind of delay.

i feel your pain...

Teacher Todd · 05-24-2011, 10:47 PM

I am to tired to look tonight, but will look and see what my paperwork shows, that can cause a delay like that. I believe that after a specified time frame if the dealer has not heard back from osp they can proceed. Also I believe you can call osp to find out. I will let you know more in the morning.

TheRedSkull · 05-25-2011, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teacher Todd

I am to tired to look tonight, but will look and see what my paperwork shows, that can cause a delay like that. I believe that after a specified time frame if the dealer has not heard back from osp they can proceed. Also I believe you can call osp to find out. I will let you know more in the morning.

yes but OSP may delay it indef for whatever reasons and while the FFL can hand it over after like a week if OSP doesnt get back to them with a reason, but really not many shops will do that it seems, my shop said they didnt even know about any of that, and werent all that concerned, they sided with the OSP "just wait it out"...

i seriously dont know why here in oregon we have the OSP calling the feds for the dealer, its an additional layer of phone tag...

god i hated when they made me wait, all they would tell me as that i must "wait and give them time to do their job", beyond that the OSP will be of no use...

why is the OSP even involved in checking their books? isnt that the point of calling the Feds?

Teacher Todd · 05-25-2011, 08:08 PM

They are involved so that they can make money.

Here is a number you can call.

Challenge Line (for denied or pended call inquiries) 503-373-1808 x327

OSP has rewritten their guide for gun dealers in Oregon and removed errors such as a statement that a transfer could not be made without an approval. In fact, in the absence of denial, transfers can take place after three business days have elapsed even if there is a "delay" or "pend."

Hope this helps.

PFWoods · 05-25-2011, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teacher Todd

They are involved so that they can make money.

Here is a number you can call.

Challenge Line (for denied or pended call inquiries) 503-373-1808 x327

OSP has rewritten their guide for gun dealers in Oregon and removed errors such as a statement that a transfer could not be made without an approval. In fact, in the absence of denial, transfers can take place after three business days have elapsed even if there is a "delay" or "pend."

Hope this helps.

Do you have the specific document to quote for that rewritten guide? It might be helpful to take to a dealer for my new handgun! Then again, they might not budge regardless. I do feel that this long a delay is not appropriate given a complete lack of deniable reasons. For goodness sakes this is absolutely criminal. I should send them a bill for long term rental of the firearm!

Teacher Todd · 05-25-2011, 08:53 PM

Check this link. It has a copy of the letter sent to FFL Dealers. Also call the number and leave a message. They will get back to you.

http://oregonfirearms.org/pdfs/OSPIN...8OSPLetter.pdf

philster · 05-26-2011, 07:12 AM

Your anger is totally valid! However I would not sweat it in terms of your eligibility to purchase if I were you. I am willing to bet they are just trying to teach the State Legislature what things will be like if their budget gets cut more. Sucks to be caught up in it, but it's a bigd*ck contest at this point everywhere in terms of budget vs. service. Hell, you'd have less of a wait in New Jersey or New York at this point.

Good luck. I hope it shakes free this week!

TheRedSkull · 05-26-2011, 12:18 PM

OSP really shouldnt be the middleman for this...

the law must change, especially if its about the budget, if its removed from their list of duties then it wont be a budget issue...

TheRedSkull · 05-26-2011, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teacher Todd

Check this link. It has a copy of the letter sent to FFL Dealers. Also call the number and leave a message. They will get back to you.

http://oregonfirearms.org/pdfs/OSPIN...8OSPLetter.pdf

that only has their numbers, it says nothing about "in the absence of denial, transfers can take place after three business days have elapsed even if there is a "delay" or "pend.""

as i said before i heard this as well, but when i brought this up to my shop they snickered and pretty much wouldnt believe me (looking for info on this rule actually led me to this forum), he then said that even if true he doubts many if any dealers would be willing to do that, it would of course be easier to just hold onto it and await word from OSP... so i find the "option" you mention as not an option, but a merely words in hope it comforts the few of us unlucky enough to get picked out by OSP...

on the plus side the human at the end of that hotline will call you back within 24hrs, but she will only tell you that you must give them their allotted time to work, beyond that she will just re-read the same laminated printout to you... oh and when i asked what the problem was she could only tell me that it was something to do with my name (no duh) and that i really needed to give them their allotted time...

i cannot express how much the run around on it angers me, and since it doesnt happen to most, they dont see a problem with it like i do.

yeah im mad!

Teacher Todd · 05-26-2011, 02:22 PM

I can not speak for his dealer only for myself. Unless I felt you were a risk because of they way you portray yourself, I would follow the rules as laid out and if I had not heard in 3 days, come get it, but thats me.

You have every right to be angry and frustrated, I know I would be. One of the reasons I got my FFL license was so that I don't have to play that game anymore.

If you really want to get tweaked, my ATF guy said he would not be surprised to see oregon raise the back ground rate to 15.00 or 20.00 in the next year or two since it is a money maker for them.

Nutty4Guns · 05-26-2011, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teacher Todd

I can not speak for his dealer only for myself. Unless I felt you were a risk because of they way you portray yourself, I would follow the rules as laid out and if I had not heard in 3 days, come get it, but thats me.

You have every right to be angry and frustrated, I know I would be. One of the reasons I got my FFL license was so that I don't have to play that game anymore.

If you really want to get tweaked, my ATF guy said he would not be surprised to see oregon raise the back ground rate to 15.00 or 20.00 in the next year or two since it is a money maker for them.

I thought I just read somewhere yesterday that they are going to raise it to 23 or 26 bucks next month. Could be wrong, but I could swear that is what I read.

TheRedSkull · 05-26-2011, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nutty4Guns

I thought I just read somewhere yesterday that they are going to raise it to 23 or 26 bucks next month. Could be wrong, but I could swear that is what I read.

yet they still cant get it right and are still an unnecessary level of phone tag, beyond them earning money with it (and likely using that money elsewhere and not on improving the system) why do we do it? what are FFL not trusted to call the feds on their own but CAN be trusted to check with the OSP, and they obviously know more than the feds? i mean if the federal government says im fit to own a gun why would oregon state police say otherwise? are they trying to deny more people firearms? do they want more control?

can anyone point out the oregon law that says the FFL may hand over the firearm without approval? because the pdf teacher todd posted says nothing in regards to that, but i know i have seen it.

does anyone know of an actual store dealer that will do the 3 days thing if the OSP doesnt give the go ahead? because i seriously doubt they would be willing to do that, one customer isnt worth the shop...

Teacher Todd · 05-26-2011, 11:04 PM

Here you go. Direct from the handbook given to every FFL dealer. The only reason OSP is involved is because it makes them money. Has nothing to do with control or limiting guns. They make a profit plain and simple. The link to the information I copied is at the bottom. As a dealer there is zero liability to me if I release a gun without approval and I followed the below guidelines. Maybe its worth buying from a little dealer over in Prineville who follow sthe law, but believes in your rights. :)

PENDED – A pended status is neither approved nor denied.
If the FICS Unit is unable to determine whether the purchaser is qualified or
disqualified from completing the transfer within 30 minutes, as required by law the
FICS Unit will provide the FFL dealer with an estimate of time when the request will
be completed.
FFL dealers must follow both state and federal law. The following is a summary of
the requirements regarding release of a firearm prior to or when no approval
number has been provided by the FICS Unit.
• ORS 166.412 (3) (c) If the department fails to provide a unique approval number to a gun
dealer or to notify the gun dealer that the purchaser is disqualified under paragraph (a) of
this subsection before the close of the gun dealer’s next business day following the request
by the dealer for a criminal history record check, the dealer may deliver the handgun to the
purchaser.
• Federal law prohibits release of a firearm until after the expiration of three business days,
not counting the day on which the dealer asks OSP to conduct a criminal history record
check, unless the OSP provides an approval number first.
Please refer to your copy of the Oregon Firearms Instant Check System –
Instruction and Informational Guide for Firearm Dealers (yellow book) and the
Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide (white book) for further detail on
this issue or contact the Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) at 503-331-7830.

http://www.oregon.gov/OSP/ID/docs/DE...NAL_011509.pdf

TheRedSkull · 05-26-2011, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teacher Todd

Here you go. Direct from the handbook given to every FFL dealer. The only reason OSP is involved is because it makes them money. Has nothing to do with control or limiting guns. They make a profit plain and simple. The link to the information I copied is at the bottom. As a dealer there is zero liability to me if I release a gun without approval and I followed the below guidelines. Maybe its worth buying from a little dealer over in Prineville who follow sthe law, but believes in your rights. :)

PENDED – A pended status is neither approved nor denied.
If the FICS Unit is unable to determine whether the purchaser is qualified or
disqualified from completing the transfer within 30 minutes, as required by law the
FICS Unit will provide the FFL dealer with an estimate of time when the request will
be completed.
FFL dealers must follow both state and federal law. The following is a summary of
the requirements regarding release of a firearm prior to or when no approval
number has been provided by the FICS Unit.
• ORS 166.412 (3) (c) If the department fails to provide a unique approval number to a gun
dealer or to notify the gun dealer that the purchaser is disqualified under paragraph (a) of
this subsection before the close of the gun dealer’s next business day following the request
by the dealer for a criminal history record check, the dealer may deliver the handgun to the
purchaser.
• Federal law prohibits release of a firearm until after the expiration of three business days,
not counting the day on which the dealer asks OSP to conduct a criminal history record
check, unless the OSP provides an approval number first.
Please refer to your copy of the Oregon Firearms Instant Check System –
Instruction and Informational Guide for Firearm Dealers (yellow book) and the
Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide (white book) for further detail on
this issue or contact the Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) at 503-331-7830.

http://www.oregon.gov/OSP/ID/docs/DE...NAL_011509.pdf

thank you for providing that, ABG Buyer's of Corvallis will NOT release a gun... so i will likely not be a repeat customer with them, i mean can OSP do anything to them for letting me have it or are they just spineless FFLs?

the OSP should not be in the business of making money, thats not their lane...

Teacher Todd · 05-27-2011, 07:33 AM

I agree on the OSP not making money. There is nothing they can do to make them move quicker. Are you buying one of their guns or did you order one and have it shipped to them? If you are buying one of there guns I would think they should allow you to cancel the deal. If you ordered it online and had it shipped there, you should be able to find another FFL to Deal with and then request it be transfered to them. Of course you may run into the same delay again depending on the dealer.

TheRedSkull · 05-27-2011, 12:22 PM

yeah i cant think of a good reason why the state police should be in the business of making money, so i dont see why they are involved at all...

oh my bad, i meant to say that this had happened previously and it really soured my experience. i was transferring a lower and the store was busy, so when the phone call starts going wrong and the guy tells me loudly the police need to investigate me and takes my lower back, with all eyes on me like im a criminal, good times...

wouldnt removing OSP from the process fix this? i mean if want a waiting period, then do that, but i really did feel like i was being singled out and it doesnt help when most oregon gun owners cant relate or even know that this can happen... i mean technically the OSP can drag their feet forever and it would still be legal...

i love how no one else thinks this is a problem in oregon (until it happens to them)...

Teacher Todd · 05-27-2011, 06:51 PM

I have heard the FBI check has the same issues and possible delays, but know experience with them on that.

TheRedSkull · 05-27-2011, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teacher Todd

I have heard the FBI check has the same issues and possible delays, but know experience with them on that.

yeah but why add another level to that?

im sure i sound like a broken record by now...

Teacher Todd · 05-27-2011, 10:00 PM

I believe there are 13 states that do this. If we didn't have OSP doing it in Oregon there would be no background fee as the feds provide it for free.

TheRedSkull · 05-27-2011, 11:42 PM

i have no problem paying the FFL a fair fee for his help and time, but i just dont think the police being involved is a good idea in any way...

03-30-2011, 07:49 PM	#1
Harvester Newbie Joined: Mar 2011 From: Oregon Posts: 3	Long delay for handgun purchase I recently saved up for a new hand gun and when the dealer called OSP for the background check they told them that it would be at the latest 30 days before they get a response. I filled the 4473 out right with my SS#. I have never had any record including traffic tickets. I have had state and Federal checks for my work. This my first Non-Face to Face firearms purchase and I am legal permanent resident of the US since I was a baby. So its been 2 weeks and still no reply. Has anyone encountered this situation? I am patiently waiting, but I hear that if it takes so long most of the time they don't respond at all? I have sent in an application for a UPIN#, but that takes months and I think it doesn't change anything because in Oregon the state does the checks. I am worried that they will make an erroneous denial or delay longer or not even respond. The dealer told me that they do not release a firearm with out a proceed(which is legal in Oregon) from the OSP. It is such a disappointment! I pay my taxes, I obey the laws, I am signed up for the draft, and I work in heath care with the public which has strict background checks and laws. Any insight, advice, experience with this would be much appreciated.

05-24-2011, 07:55 PM	#8
PFWoods Newbie Joined: May 2011 From: BEaverton Posts: 4	Long delay for handgun purchase I am now at 60 days for the purchase. The item was purchased online and now sits in a local pawn shop since April 2011. There simply MUST be a better way for Oregon to conduct their business. There si no reason whatsoever for this kind of delay.

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03-30-2011, 08:08 PM	#2
Nutty4Guns Marksman Joined: Feb 2011 From: Portland, Oregon Posts: 254	Something with your name and or Identification might be very similar with someone else. I have never heard of this happening, so I am just guessing. I have done numerous purchases with many different dealers and have always been approved instantly over the phone. Best of luck to you. I hope it all works out.

03-30-2011, 11:20 PM	#3
Little Bear Gunslinger Joined: Feb 2011 From: Salem, OR Posts: 60	Just keep checking back! And if that doesn't pan out, you could always try a different store. Some shop owners get wierded out for the strangest reason then blame it on OSP.

03-31-2011, 02:37 PM	#4
KrautBurner Gunslinger Joined: Jan 2009 From: Bremerton, Wa Posts: 68	I've purchased in Oregon (when I was a resident) no wait. but I was also Military and figure'd I was on file anyways. if you really wanna know what they are looking at, you can get a copy of your criminal record: FBI — Criminal Background Check

04-02-2011, 06:14 PM	#6
Dragon Rider Gunslinger Joined: Mar 2011 From: US Posts: 31	got a rifle and pistol within last 30 days, each was approved over the phone and took less than 5 min to complete.

05-24-2011, 10:47 PM	#10
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	I am to tired to look tonight, but will look and see what my paperwork shows, that can cause a delay like that. I believe that after a specified time frame if the dealer has not heard back from osp they can proceed. Also I believe you can call osp to find out. I will let you know more in the morning.

05-25-2011, 08:08 PM	#12
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	They are involved so that they can make money. Here is a number you can call. Challenge Line (for denied or pended call inquiries) 503-373-1808 x327 OSP has rewritten their guide for gun dealers in Oregon and removed errors such as a statement that a transfer could not be made without an approval. In fact, in the absence of denial, transfers can take place after three business days have elapsed even if there is a "delay" or "pend." Hope this helps.

05-25-2011, 08:53 PM	#14
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	Check this link. It has a copy of the letter sent to FFL Dealers. Also call the number and leave a message. They will get back to you. http://oregonfirearms.org/pdfs/OSPIN...8OSPLetter.pdf

05-26-2011, 07:12 AM	#15
philster Marksman Joined: May 2011 From: Woodinville WA Posts: 255	Your anger is totally valid! However I would not sweat it in terms of your eligibility to purchase if I were you. I am willing to bet they are just trying to teach the State Legislature what things will be like if their budget gets cut more. Sucks to be caught up in it, but it's a bigd*ck contest at this point everywhere in terms of budget vs. service. Hell, you'd have less of a wait in New Jersey or New York at this point. Good luck. I hope it shakes free this week!

05-26-2011, 12:18 PM	#16
TheRedSkull Rifleman Joined: Apr 2011 From: Corvallis, OR Posts: 204	OSP really shouldnt be the middleman for this... the law must change, especially if its about the budget, if its removed from their list of duties then it wont be a budget issue...

05-26-2011, 02:22 PM	#18
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	I can not speak for his dealer only for myself. Unless I felt you were a risk because of they way you portray yourself, I would follow the rules as laid out and if I had not heard in 3 days, come get it, but thats me. You have every right to be angry and frustrated, I know I would be. One of the reasons I got my FFL license was so that I don't have to play that game anymore. If you really want to get tweaked, my ATF guy said he would not be surprised to see oregon raise the back ground rate to 15.00 or 20.00 in the next year or two since it is a money maker for them.

05-26-2011, 11:04 PM	#21
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	Here you go. Direct from the handbook given to every FFL dealer. The only reason OSP is involved is because it makes them money. Has nothing to do with control or limiting guns. They make a profit plain and simple. The link to the information I copied is at the bottom. As a dealer there is zero liability to me if I release a gun without approval and I followed the below guidelines. Maybe its worth buying from a little dealer over in Prineville who follow sthe law, but believes in your rights. :) PENDED – A pended status is neither approved nor denied. If the FICS Unit is unable to determine whether the purchaser is qualified or disqualified from completing the transfer within 30 minutes, as required by law the FICS Unit will provide the FFL dealer with an estimate of time when the request will be completed. FFL dealers must follow both state and federal law. The following is a summary of the requirements regarding release of a firearm prior to or when no approval number has been provided by the FICS Unit. • ORS 166.412 (3) (c) If the department fails to provide a unique approval number to a gun dealer or to notify the gun dealer that the purchaser is disqualified under paragraph (a) of this subsection before the close of the gun dealer’s next business day following the request by the dealer for a criminal history record check, the dealer may deliver the handgun to the purchaser. • Federal law prohibits release of a firearm until after the expiration of three business days, not counting the day on which the dealer asks OSP to conduct a criminal history record check, unless the OSP provides an approval number first. Please refer to your copy of the Oregon Firearms Instant Check System – Instruction and Informational Guide for Firearm Dealers (yellow book) and the Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide (white book) for further detail on this issue or contact the Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) at 503-331-7830. http://www.oregon.gov/OSP/ID/docs/DE...NAL_011509.pdf

05-27-2011, 07:33 AM	#23
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	I agree on the OSP not making money. There is nothing they can do to make them move quicker. Are you buying one of their guns or did you order one and have it shipped to them? If you are buying one of there guns I would think they should allow you to cancel the deal. If you ordered it online and had it shipped there, you should be able to find another FFL to Deal with and then request it be transfered to them. Of course you may run into the same delay again depending on the dealer.

05-27-2011, 12:22 PM	#24
TheRedSkull Rifleman Joined: Apr 2011 From: Corvallis, OR Posts: 204	yeah i cant think of a good reason why the state police should be in the business of making money, so i dont see why they are involved at all... oh my bad, i meant to say that this had happened previously and it really soured my experience. i was transferring a lower and the store was busy, so when the phone call starts going wrong and the guy tells me loudly the police need to investigate me and takes my lower back, with all eyes on me like im a criminal, good times... wouldnt removing OSP from the process fix this? i mean if want a waiting period, then do that, but i really did feel like i was being singled out and it doesnt help when most oregon gun owners cant relate or even know that this can happen... i mean technically the OSP can drag their feet forever and it would still be legal... i love how no one else thinks this is a problem in oregon (until it happens to them)...

05-27-2011, 06:51 PM	#25
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	I have heard the FBI check has the same issues and possible delays, but know experience with them on that.

05-27-2011, 10:00 PM	#27
Teacher Todd Rifleman Joined: Jan 2011 From: Prineville, OR Posts: 173	I believe there are 13 states that do this. If we didn't have OSP doing it in Oregon there would be no background fee as the feds provide it for free.

05-27-2011, 11:42 PM	#28
TheRedSkull Rifleman Joined: Apr 2011 From: Corvallis, OR Posts: 204	i have no problem paying the FFL a fair fee for his help and time, but i just dont think the police being involved is a good idea in any way...